Swift Chat with Derrick Kinney: Unlocking Success with Passion, Partnerships, and Positive Mindset

In this Swift Chat conversation, Marie Swift speaks with Derrick Kinney, Best-Selling Book Author, Keynote Speaker, and Host of the Good Money podcast, to unpack the secrets behind his success and the strategies that have helped countless individuals achieve financial freedom. He also shares advice for financial advisors who might be looking to emulate his success in building a multi-million dollar financial advisory business then selling it a few years ago to focus on what he calls "Derrick 2.0" wherein he now has more time to focus on coaching/mentoring other advisors, and addressing groups of financial advisors at hosted events.

Kinney shares his personal journey, highlighting the pivotal moments that shaped his career and the lessons he learned along the way, emphasizing the crucial role of passion in achieving professional success. He also delves into the power of a positive mindset, its role in overcoming challenges, and the significance of building and nurturing strong partnerships. Throughout the conversation, Kinney offers practical advice on navigating the complexities of the financial world, from investment strategies to retirement planning -- and for building a highly successful financial advisory firm.

Learn more about Derrick Kinney and his Success For Advisors program at SuccessForAdvisors.com.

Listen to Podcast / Audio Version

---

Transcript of the Conversation

​Marie Swift: Hey, everybody. Welcome back to another great Swift Chat. I am so excited to have my old friend Derrick Kinney here. Derrick is a podcast host, best-selling book author, and a former financial advisor. Once an advisor, always an advisor. Derrick is known to many in the advisory community as the advisor to advisors. We're going to talk about what would be helpful to advisors. Derrick, you and I go way back, so maybe we'll also talk about that. The first thing that occurs to me is that no one would ever accuse you of being a slacker. You're all over social media and speaking and writing books. Talk to us a little bit about what you've done and why. How do you bring so much energy to everything you do?

Derrick Kinney: I've always believed that people purchase passion. Even when I was a brand-new advisor, I realized that if I acted like I really loved what I was doing, it made people want to know more about what I was doing. I never wanted to be disingenuous by any sense of the imagination, but I realized that if people I talked to had an excitement about them or charisma, it automatically made me want to get to know them better. As a professional, it taught me that if I was going to be a financial advisor and people thought of me as a commodity, every advisor does the exact same thing. Charisma and the passion I brought was free, and I needed to bring it freely. It helped attract people to me and ultimately helped grow the business.

Swift: You're so right. People are buying you, first and foremost, as the leader of your organization. Who wants to work with somebody who's low affect? We all have those days when we're serious, or there's a little gray cloud floating over our heads. But one of my mentors told me to fake it till you make it. Not to be a phony, but sometimes you must tell yourself, “Today is a good day, and I'm bringing the energy, and I'm going to add value.”
 
Kinney: Yes, and there's only one today. Candidly, there are some mornings, like the one I had yesterday. Coming off the Easter holiday, it was a Tuesday morning, and I didn't really want to get out of bed, but I thought there were things I needed to do. Once I began to do them, the motivation and the passion kicked in. It's about realizing that you're going to face hard things, and you get to choose whether to face them with a low or a high attitude. Over time, one tends to pay a lot more.

Swift: Absolutely. Thank you for that beautiful LinkedIn post this morning. I believe that was about how if you want to go fast, walk alone. If you want to go further, walk together. What would you add to that?

Kinney: You and I have just recently formed a partnership. It's interesting when I work with people who can help me get to where I want to go and help serve advisors more. Sometimes, you don't see the results for 30, 60, or 90 days. I've told you this many times: once I signed that contract, the magic began to happen. It was such a breath of fresh air because I like the people that I work with to be an extension of me. Thank you for that. I think that puts you in rare air, and this is just how you do business; it's nothing new. But as somebody who is new to you in this relationship, I think more people can learn from you.
 
I’ve realized that I've always been an achiever. My enneagram is a three, and my results of a personality profile are always about achieving. If I haven't achieved, I feel like I'm failing. There's no middle ground, which is crazy. So many people can relate to that. I realized that you can achieve your own, but then you reach the summit, look around, and see that there's nobody there with you. That's a lonely place, and nobody knows the journey, the hardship, the struggle, and there's no shared story. The older I get, the more I teach my kids, who are all very entrepreneurial, to work with a team. It can be hard because your ideas are always the best; nobody can do it as well as you can, and all the things I struggled with. It may feel like you're going slower, but with a team, you're building into them, and they're building into you, which will help you scale that business much faster. Most importantly, you're also scaling them as people and helping them reach their full potential while you reach yours. It’s a powerful thing to be at the summit together and celebrate.

Swift: It sure is. I know you've built teams and have been building a new team lately, we'll talk about that in a minute. There's such pride and joy in bringing people along with me on the journey. It's fantastic. This may be kind of counterintuitive to what you said this morning, but you also were published in Communication Intelligence, and the premise was that sometimes what is slow is actually fast.

Kinney: It's funny that the article was published in Communication Intelligence, but to be honest, often my communication isn't that intelligent. I've learned from a lot of mistakes along the way. One of my favorite movies is 42, it's the story of Jackie Robinson. He's breaking the color barrier in baseball, and there's a lot of intense scrutiny on him. One of the scenes is when he's about to step off the bus to face this whole barrage of reporters. The person accompanying him says, “Jackie, just like you like to see the pitches coming slow, you want to make sure you see the reporter's questions come in slow.” That always stuck with me. Sometimes, we want to respond so fast, and we think that people judge us, our intellect, and our intelligence by how quickly we respond. I find that the questions should come in slowly, but your answers to the questions come in even slower. One thing I learned about myself recently, it was hard to look in the mirror and realize this, but I tend to run fast. Without a plan I can run fast in a circle, and I get nowhere fast.
 
About ten years ago, I began to go on a yearly sabbatical where I would take about five days completely by myself. Many people listening might think, “My gosh, Derrick, what could I do for five days by myself?” There were three questions that guided me; What can I do to be a better husband? What can I do to be a better father? What can I do to be a better business owner? Those were the three pillars that guided my thinking. I realized that if I ran fast for 52 weeks of the year, I needed to take one week to figure out what I was running fast toward. That really helped shape and guide me. I began writing out goals and making promises about what I wanted the year to be about. So that a year from then I could look back and say it wasn't just about making the money I wanted or hitting my assets under management goal, etc. What purpose and meaning did I experience, and did I improve other people's lives, specifically my family and those I care about the most? I realized that I have to take time to get really slow and deliberate about what it is I want and don't want before I get really fast again. Once I have that crystallized and clear, I can go fast deliberately. I felt like I was wasting time when I was taking the slow time. But it actually makes up time because I'm focused on exactly what I want.

Swift: That's very good advice. It reminds me of speaking with Steve Atkinson; he's phenomenal. I've known him for years through Loring Ward and then Buckingham; now, he's part of admired leadership as one of their coaches. Steve said something that tied back to Teddy Roosevelt about stubborn indecision, and I've been embracing that as a reminder because sometimes it's better to do nothing than to make the wrong decision. We can't be stuck in inertia. Right now, I'm going through some stuff with my blended family and my mother in Utah, and things are not going so well. So, I'm being stubbornly indecisive about some things because I want to ensure that I'm protecting my mom and doing what’s right for her. Do you have anything to add to that?

Kinney: First, what you shared during a moment of vulnerability lets everybody know that everybody's family has stuff going on. Thank you for sharing that. Many of us are protectors and providers for our family; we want to be the hunter, the gatherer, and the family problem solver, and we feel we must do something. We feel a sense of accomplishment from the action of doing. Especially for achiever-minded people, it can unintendedly get us into trouble. Sometimes, the best action is simply no action and not letting the voices in our head convince us that our inaction is laziness or we don't know what we're doing. Instead, the most sophisticated, thoughtful approach we can take is waiting. Whether it's through prayer, meditation, asking for advice, or just figuring out in our head what the best course of action is, that is the greatest thing we can do in those moments.

Swift: In the mornings, I see a lot of great LinkedIn missives from you on my feed. How do you come up with so many insightful and powerful LinkedIn messages? Do you ever run out of ideas?

Kinney: I thought that I would, and there are some days I think I will. But I keep a record throughout the week. I'm 55 now, and many years ago, one of my favorite shows was Seinfeld. Some of our listeners can relate to that show. What made it so unique and appealing was that they talked about real-life issues we all faced. I find that much of tv and other things today are made up. When there's a topic that people can immediately relate to, they connect with it. So, throughout the week, I'm sort of a problem detective and inquisitive. If I feel like I didn't receive good service, I bet other people like me would have that same complaint. I write that idea down. Throughout the week, I assemble these ideas. Candidly, typically on Friday or Saturday, it takes about 3 hours to write the content. I think who is an advisor right now who knows they are better than what their current revenue numbers say but keep hitting the ceiling. They're working hard, and it's not from lack of work or desire that they don't know how to break through.

What could I say to them in a way that is genuine and based on personal experience to help them achieve a goal today? I want them to read the post and take action to help them grow their business, improve their life, or have a better conversation with their spouse or kids so they hit the pillow at night knowing they lived a full day of meaning. That's what guides me. I think about one person; some days it may be a man, others it's a woman. Who needs to hear this message right now and be vulnerable? Sometimes, I'm a little embarrassed about what I write, but I want to be authentic to myself and talk about what I’m feeling. I think other people may have those same feelings, and it can help them grow their business.

Swift: I know you're a busy man. You're on television, in the community speaking, and you have a passion project. You have your own podcast,  the Good Money podcast which is based on your book, the Good Money Revolution, which I have right here. You were so kind as to send me a copy and to write me a nice little note. The personal touch meant so much to me. Let's talk about your book and podcast, how you approach the media, and why you still do media when you don't really need to serve the general public anymore because you're not courting wealth management clients. Where would you like to begin that conversation?

Kinney: Let’s go back to when I was a 26-year-old brand new financial advisor. I took six years to finish four years in college; I was working full-time. When I was a new advisor, I always had a passion for making money, saving, and investing. I enjoyed seeing my money grow. I thought it'd be fun to become an advisor. I saw my parents struggle and their friends struggle. All of them worked hard, but nobody gave them a game plan or told them what to do, how to save, or have the retirement they wanted. But my problem was I was 26, but I looked like I was 13. I thought, who would invest with me? I realized that I couldn't compete with people who had country club memberships, the big Rolodexes, and all the contacts. It was just me. I had a passion for investing in the lives of young people, specifically supporting local education.
 
I went back to my high school, Sam Houston, in Arlington. I still live in Arlington and have lived there since 6th grade. I told them I'd like to award a student and a teacher of the month. I had a $50 Amazon gift card for the teacher and a $25 gift card for the student. I Got a picture with the teacher, the student, and the principal, and it was published in the paper. A few months go by, and I get phone calls from people saying, “We'd like you to be our advisor.” I'll never forget the call when a woman said, “We'd like you to be our advisor. We saw the work you're doing at Sam Houston High School.” This had to be the most unprofessional thing I could ever say. I said, “Ma'am, if you don't mind me asking, I'm 26. I'm brand new. Why do you want to work with me?” What she said changed everything. She said, “Derrick, we want to work with you because you care about what we care about.” That's when the light bulb went off.

I realized that she could work with any financial advisor. She assumed I was competent, knew what I was doing, would provide good service, and get her money to grow. She wanted to work with someone who cared the same about providing a great education for people. At that moment, I realized the best way to decommoditize and differentiate myself was to be a friend of the community. Ultimately, high-net-worth people and people with money don't always have the time to give back and be part of a cause they care about; they want to partner with professionals who do. It made them feel good because they could work with any advisor, but they worked with me because I was part of the community solving those problems.

Fast forward through all that. That was how I built my business. I wanted to write a book to encourage anybody who gives advice and receives payment for it not to think, I've got to be the smartest person, the best looking, and to drive the nicest car. I was never those things. As long as you care about what the people you want to work with care about, it will likely be a doorway to at least an initial introduction to serve them. The book's premise was I began to hear that if you make money or like making money, you're bad, that money is bad, and that if you want to be a good person, you shouldn't worry about money.

I wanted to turn that on its side and say, go make money. Go make a lot of money, but make it for the good you can do in people's lives, your own life, and your family's life. Don’t be subject to a culture that says you're bad if you think about money. Because if we want to make an impact on causes, money is often the greatest tool for positive change that we have. Go make a lot of money, but realize that if your only goal is to make a million dollars or pad your bank account, you'll feel good initially, but that high will wear off. When you add meaning to your money, it's a lasting significance that you'll feel, which is what I want for every reader.

Swift: That reminds me of Bill & Melinda Gates. They're making a difference with their money.

Kinney: They are making a big difference. When you say that, many people might think it's Bill Gates, Jeff Bezos, or Elon Musk and those people have tons of money, so they have the money to give. What I want to tell people who are listening is, if you have a $1, $5, $20, or $50, next time you're at the dinner table with your family or friends, ask: what would be a cause that we all care about, that we could begin to make a difference in? I’ve realized that even for people who feel like they're barely making ends meet, or their practice isn't where they want it to be, and every dollar is sacred to them, when you give even a dollar, you're in control of that dollar's impact. There’s a concept that says if I wait to give, the future value of my money is worth more than the present value today. Most estate planning is built on that premise of giving. Let's flip that around and say that money given today has a greater value than in the future because of the impact that money can have. Even a dollar given today can start impacting someone's life over the next ten years, as opposed to waiting until you have a larger amount.

Swift: I saw in your LinkedIn posts that you had groups of teenagers around two long tables. You had teenagers come to your home. What are some of those conversations like?

Kinney: We just did that last night. We call it family dinner. This came about because some good friends of ours would have their kids over for dinner every week. Those friends ended up moving away, but their kids stayed in the area. As a courtesy to them and because we love their family, we decided to have their kids over for dinner once a week. Then we expanded it, and we began to let others know that if they're a younger person, thinking about getting married, or newly married, then come to our house. From 6:30 pm to 9:30 pm every Tuesday night, we provide food-free conversations and a way for people to build relationships.

Last night was a special moment. We had 15 people there. Many of our own kids show up, and they bring their friends, which is great. There are two circles. My wife was at one end of the table having a conversation, we were debating. One person was talking about how they wanted to start a business. The person was struggling because they don’t believe they’re adding value. They were wondering; why should they buy from me? We all went around the table giving them requested advice.

We came up with this: if you believe that you're adding value, sometimes you have to think from their perspective and not your own limited belief perspective, like, it's not worth what I'm charging, or they won't like this. If you can solve their problem, let them be the determiner of value, and don't shut yourself down before you give them a chance. It was a really good discussion. We talk about politics, culture, many things. I'm a dreamer, a big idea guy, I like to keep adding value to people. When you're around younger people, it keeps you motivated and honest. Because I can't just tell them about an idea. I've got to put that idea into practice because they're asking me about it next week. It will help me be a better version of myself.

Swift: Your podcast is also phenomenal, and you have interviewed some remarkable people, some of whom are celebrities or household names. Who are some of your favorite guests and favorite conversations on the podcast?

Kinney: That's sort of like asking who my favorite child is. There have been so many great guests. I jokingly say that I hope that our audience enjoys this because, as the host, I'm learning so much. One that I enjoyed the most was Matthew McConaughey. Matthew was on a podcast tour with a new book coming out a couple of years ago called Greenlights. We were able to get him on the show. One of the things he talked about was pulling back the curtain about how even though you're wildly successful, you still have struggles and fears, and you want to be a good dad to your kids and a good spouse. He discussed the concept of the soul's account versus the bank account.

He talked about how you can have a bulging bank account, but if your soul's account, your relationships, and how you think about yourself and your kids and your family are depleted, then you're as poor as someone who doesn't have any money in the bank at all. That was a really good concept for me, to make sure that I have both a good bank account and a good souls account. One of the other guests was not necessarily a household name, but is the co-founder of Netflix, Marc Randolph. Marc Randolph dismissed a lot of the fact that people think you've got to learn business only by going to college.

At the end of our interview, he talked about how his son loves to skateboard. When many people are on the edge of the bowl and are about to drop in, they tend to lean back, hoping to soften the blow so they don't fall. Because of that hesitancy and leaning backward, he says, “Derrick, it causes people to fall every time. What people have to do is they have to, in that moment, they've got to lean into the bowl, counterintuitive, feel the fear for a moment. And when they do that and drop in, they rarely ever fall.” I think about that picture almost every day because if you're doing meaningful things and making quite a bit of money, you'll probably be uncomfortable at some part of your day. You must be doing what other people don't want to do. Those people typically make the most money, can do the most good, and grow their business. If everything you're doing is comfortable, you're probably not achieving your full potential. So that picture was: I needed to make a phone call, so I had to either pull back or lean into the bowl and go in. Once I'm on that call, typically, good things happen.

Swift: It's like when my dad taught me how to drive. He taught me a couple of things, ten and two on the steering wheel, of course. He taught me to feel the car, the rumble in my seat, and to put my knee on the door so I could feel the road and anything going wrong with the car. He told me to look far ahead and lean in and accelerate into the curves, counterintuitively, especially when skidding out in the snow.
 
I want to go back because we haven't talked about your earlier book. It's from when you and I first started to know each other. You were at maybe the peak of your career as a financial advisor, and you were out on the street speaking circuit. I met you at a top producer or top advisor conference. It may have been the Money 2020 show. What were we doing? Talking about credibility, marketing, and PR?

Kinney: It might have been in Las Vegas. You and I were on a panel together. Larry Chambers and a handful of other people were there. I remember being impressed with your marketing message. That's what stuck out to me.

Swift: Thank you. You had your book; Master the Media to Attract Your Ideal Clients, which is kind of what you did after you started the school and the community visibility and got out on the speaking circuit and into the news. That book today would be just as valid as it was back then.

Kinney: It's funny; the cover of the book looks like I wrote it back in the 1800s. The reason I wrote that book was because I loved working with the media. I mentioned that I had a problem when I was 26 about how to create visibility for myself as an advisor. I've always enjoyed communication. Communication is something that is taken for granted so much. In relationships, it comes down to having good, empathetic understanding and patient communication.
 
When I started off at the broker-dealer that I was with, I sent faxes. People probably don't even know what a fax machine is these days. I would get to the office super early and send the TV producers a fax that said, “When you need someone to talk about financial topics in an easy-to-understand way, call me.” I did a couple of bullet points like; five ways to save for education, three ways to reduce credit card debt, etc. I always put numbers in there to catch their attention. One day, I got a call, and they said, “Derrick, we'd love to have you come on the air and talk about this.” I said that I was happy to do it. I acted like I had done it all the time and like I was a seasoned pro, and I practiced over and over again.

I visualized that when the interview was done, the producer would say, “Derrick, you’re made for TV. Would you come on a regular basis?” The interview went off without a hitch. In the end, the producer said something along the lines of, “Derrick, that was great. Would you be our regular money guy and come on often?” I said yes, I would love to do it. That's how it started.

Today, we've moved away from TV and towards Instagram and LinkedIn. There are probably people you like to quote and follow. You like their content, so you look forward to reading what they say and watching their videos. You probably have never met them in person, but you feel like you have. For me, that's what TV was and still is. If I'm on local TV each week in Dallas, Fort Worth, and occasionally on the national news when they need complex topics explained in an easy-to-understand way, it builds a relationship and a rapport. A lot of how I built my practice was being on local TV in Dallas, Fort Worth. People would come into my office and say that I seem the same on the air as I do in person, which was the ultimate compliment.
 
I've always had my office near a highway. I've always been a very vigilant marketer. Every day, people are moving away from where I live in Arlington, Texas, and I will never see them again. New people are also moving into Arlington every day. I must turn my marketing message up loud daily because new people have never heard of me. I say ABM: always be marketing. You have to be out there. You have to put your message out there. Don't just hit people with a random message. You have to be strategic and surgical. Use a relatable problem that people can connect with, so they say, “That's exactly what I'm struggling with. I didn't realize that you could help me with that.” When they have that thought, you become a doorway to helping them achieve their financial freedom.

Swift: I love it. Always be marketing. I was under the training of a top producer back in the day when I got my sea legs in the business. He said to always be closing, which was what he did best. I became the marketing director of that group of top producers, and that's how I learned to love this business. It's a long story about how I got to where I am today. But speaking about how you got to where you are today, tell us what you're doing these days. What's your passion? What are you doing?

Kinney: A couple of years ago, I realized that I wanted to do something bigger. If you follow athletes, you probably have a favorite, and they tend to stick around too long. You might think that they should have retired back at their peak so you didn't have to see them struggle. I realized that I loved what I was doing, serving clients, and I loved my team, but I had a desire to help more advisors. I wanted to help other advice givers grow their business and achieve the breakthroughs that I did, that they may be struggling with. I sold it. I needed to bet on myself to do that and reinvent myself. I call it Derrick 2.0.

Marie, with your help, your team, and my goals and big ideas, we've launched successforadvisors.com. This is specifically for financial advisors and their firms that want their advisors to grow and stand out, giving them the okay to make more money to do more good with it. I do coaching and speaking with that, and I also have some other side projects. I still have a passion for the personal finance side and helping make complex topics easy to understand. My advisor space is on LinkedIn. The personal side is more on Instagram. I want to help every American, whether you're an advisor or someone struggling financially. I want to give you the tools to live the life you want.  

Swift: If you're an advisor, need some coaching, or are a meeting planner and need a great speaker, look at Derrick. Look at his website. Derrick, couldn't you talk about this to advisor groups, as the book author is not competing for their clients?

Kinney: That's such a great way to put it. The benefit of this book is that it helps advisors get reinvigorated, remotivated, and repurposed regarding what they can do as an advisor. Additionally, we're having people bring us in to talk to groups of clients who are business owners and who want to grow their business; they can use these concepts. We know if your clients grow their business, it will grow your business as their advisor. There's more money to manage as well.

Swift: This has been delightful. We should get back together soon and discuss the do's and don'ts of working with the media and the pitfalls to avoid. I have some war stories, and I imagine you do, too. Let's save that for another time. Derrick, thank you so much for being with us today. It's been wonderful.

Kinney: I loved it. Thank you for the invite, Marie.

Find More great Swift chats here

Copyright © 2024 by Impact Communications, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
This article/blog post is the intellectual property of Impact Communications, Inc. Any reproduction or use of this content without the express written consent of the author is prohibited. For permissions, please contact [email protected]. Attribution to Impact Communications, Inc. must be provided for any use of this work in accordance with the terms specified by the author. This article first appeared on ImpactCommunications.org on 7/8/24 and was sourced by a professional at Impact Communications, Inc.